Episode 82: [Coaching Call] Marketing Your Course with Nicole Vaccaro

Creating a course is a labor of love. On this coaching call, I’m talking with Nicole Vaccaro about how to get your course in front of potential clients in a way that’s aligned with you and that provides value to your audience.

82: [Coaching Call] Marketing Your Course with Nicole Vaccaro

There's no one-size-fits-all approach to effectively marketing your course and growing your audience. Today we're looking at the questions to ask yourself and different strategies you can use when it comes time to market your course.

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Show Notes

There’s no one-size-fits-all approach to effectively marketing your course and growing your audience. Today we’re looking at the questions to ask yourself and different strategies you can use when it comes time to market your course.

If you’ve been around for a while, you’ll know that these coaching calls are some of my favorite episodes because I get to connect with and serve coaches who are making big things happen in their business. I can’t think of a better example of that than Nicole Vaccaro, who joins me on the show today.

With over 10 years of experience working as a licensed counselor, teaching, and supporting people at all stages of their lives and careers, Nicole specializes in helping people create joy in their work lives.

On today’s call, Nicole shares the inspiration and goals behind her new 6-month coaching program which helps people create their dream job roadmap and we explore different approaches she can use in her marketing to bring more students to the course.

If you've been thinking about creating your own course or if you have a course and you're looking for ways to increase your enrollment and get more eyes on what you're doing, then I think you are going to find terrific value in today's episode.

Topics covered

  • Nicole’s course creation journey
  • Why Nicole created a course around building your dream career
  • Finding the sweet spot between a results-oriented and a benefits-oriented view in your marketing
  • Educating your prospective clients and students without overwhelming them
  • How to help people to get ready to take the next step with you
  • Knowing when to ask for help
  • Choosing the platform to focus on
  • Scaling the coaching element within your course

Resources mentioned

Now it’s time for you to show the world what it means to be a Coach with Clarity! Screenshot this episode and tag me on Instagram @coachwithclarity and let me know what you’re more excited to explore in future podcast episodes!

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Well hello, my friend. Welcome to the Coach with Clarity Podcast. I'm your host, Lee Chaix McDonough, and today we have another coaching call for you. Now coaching calls are some of my very favorite episodes of the Coach with Clarity Podcast, because it's my opportunity to show up, connect with, and serve coaches who are making big things happen in their businesses. And today, I can't think of a better example of that than Nicole Vaccaro. Nicole is a licensed therapist and coach who specializes in helping people create joy in their work life. In fact, she has a dynamic, new six month coaching course and program devoted to helping people create their dream job roadmap. And Nicole reached out with some questions about how to effectively market this course and grow her audience. So that is what we are diving into during today's coaching call. So if you've been thinking about creating your own course, or if you have a course and you're looking for ways to increase your enrollment and get more eyes on what you're doing, then I think you are going to find terrific value in today's episode. So let's get right to it. Here is my coaching call with Nicole Vaccaro.

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Lee: Nicole, thank you so much for coming on the Coach with Clarity Podcast, I am thrilled to welcome you.
Nicole: Thank you very much. It's a pleasure to be here.
Lee: Tell me a little bit about what you would like to talk about during our time together today.
Nicole: Well, I have a course called the Dream Career Roadmap. I am a career coach. Just briefly, it's part of my six month training program. It has 10 modules. And it coincides with a coaching call every two weeks. And the questions I have were about marketing the course, offering it as a standalone product, and sort of refining the offering. I did some beta testing amongst friends, and everyday folks, and instructional designers and got feedback. So I'm just at the beginning of offering the course.
Lee: Oh my gosh, this is so exciting. So I love Dream Career Roadmap, that it's so clear, I know exactly what it is you're offering and what I can expect to get out of that just from that title. So well done on that.
Nicole: Thank you very much. Thank you, and also the coach on this. I’m excited.
Lee: Yeah. I can't wait to hear more about it. Yeah, so it's six months, 10 modules, coaching calls every two weeks, sounds like you have a really strong structure to it. And now it's about launching it and getting it out into the world.
Nicole: Absolutely. And it's already up on teachable, but I need to refine it. And I need to look at the marketing and all kinds of things that we just discussed. So.
Lee: So let me ask you, if we were to fast forward, say 30-45 minutes into the future, and we're wrapping up our session,  what would you want to have accomplished? What would a successful outcome look like for you?
Nicole: I think just discussing, I know that you have successfully produced many courses. So getting your thoughts on marketing the course. And also one of my eventual goals is to have it as a standalone product. So also just getting an idea of what that might look like, or for a standalone product so I can sell that, you know, separately from the coaching package.
Lee: Yes. So we're looking at marketing this first as a live run, and then maybe looking at what it would be like to turn it into evergreen or a standalone where people can always access it.
Nicole: Yes, exactly. That's right.
Lee: All right. Um, I would love to know, before we dive into all of the nuts and bolts of this, tell me why you chose to create a course around building your dream career. Why is this so important to you?
Nicole: Well, I want to give you a little context and tell you about myself, and then I will definitely respond to your question. So I am a worldwide expat. I've lived all over the globe. I've lived in the Philippines, France, Switzerland, and I have 10 years plus experience as a licensed mental health counselor. And I have worked in so many settings. I've been in private practice, I worked in a jail, I worked in insurance. And what I really enjoyed most as a therapist was helping folks to find joy in their work lives, because that always cropped up for me and for my clients. They're unhappy in their work, I think of 1000s of clients that I've served, most people hated their jobs. So  recently I pivoted into the coaching space, and I'm a career coach. And I want to help clients in a more dynamic, focused forward way. And so I've created the Dream Career Roadmap because I want to help people love their jobs, and I want them to find joy in their lives. And that's the reason why I've created this course and why it's so important today. Because they go together, if you're happy with your work, you're happy in your life, and vice versa. So they go, they go together.
Lee: I love that. I have to tell you, I have such a deep visceral response when you were talking about helping people find joy in their work life, in their life in general, but especially in their work. Because as you alluded to, I think a lot of us have had work experiences that have been anything but joyful. And so the idea that it's possible to create joy in the workplace is so liberating. It just feels so good.
Nicole: Yes, it's a paradigm that I'm really concentrating on and really encouraging. I'm really bringing that out into the world because I believe you can have joy in your job. I mean, I love what I do now, I didn't always love the settings. I've always loved being a counselor, and now as a coach, I love being a coach. But the settings were not a lot of the settings were not right for me. So I help people just sort of navigate some of their career choices and find ways to really be happy, because life is short.
Lee: Yes, yes. And it's too short to work in a job that doesn't bring you joy.
Nicole: Yeah, that you hate, right?
Lee: Yes, yes. So as a career coach, I know that you do some one-on-one work. And now we're really looking at bringing this course out as another way to serve your ideal client, someone who's really looking to find that joy, that revitalization in their work.
Nicole:Yes, absolutely.
Lee: Okay. So you mentioned wanting to talk about the marketing, does that feel like a good place to begin?
Nicole: Yes, it does.
Lee: Okay, so tell me what's on your mind when it comes to marketing this course?
Nicole: Okay, well, here are some of the things I'm thinking about. I need a tab on my website, describing the course and really kind of boosting it up a bit, because I haven't done that yet. I need to feature the course on my website more prominently. And I have not done that yet. It's mentioned in the offering of the career satisfaction offering, but I would like to get it up there on the website, featured on Instagram, and also just put it in my bio in different places, because I'm in a lot of Facebook groups. And those are just the things that have come to mind already. But…
Lee: Yes, yes. So tell me more about what you would like to see on your website with regard to this course. You kind of mentioned it a little bit, but it wants its own place to shine.
Nicole: Right? I really do want to talk it up as it were, and really make it have its own rightful place on the site. I am going to be meeting with the web designer I've been working with over the last couple months. She also is a copywriter, and to really get that language out there about it, and to get folks excited about it. And to really, you know, have it be noticed. And I think that needs a place on my website to do so.
Lee: Absolutely. We want to have a place where people can land. And they're looking at your course and thinking, “This is exactly what I need and what I want”.So would you like to approach this then as if this were the sales page? I mean, is this where people are coming to learn about it and then choosing to buy?
Nicole: Well yes, I mean that it would be a sales page. But I also have it as career satisfaction coaching on another page. So I think what this page would be, yes, it would be a sales page. But it would also, I'm also going to list the course outline because I want folks to know what they're getting into. You know , what's going to be available for that for them. You know, like one of my first modules is permission to change.
Lee: Excellent. I think you've really hit on something here. And this is something we can talk about, and will be really important for your copywriter as well. When we are looking at sales pages, especially for programs,  we're really looking at hitting that sweet spot between taking a results oriented view and a benefits oriented view. So the results oriented view is helping your students, or your client, see themselves in the story and understand what they will be able to think, feel, or do differently as a result of completing your course or being a part of your program. Versus the benefits, which is what they get. And I think you need to have both on a sales page, you know, people will buy into the result. But they also want to know, well, what am I getting for my investment? So the idea of walking through your curriculum, demonstrating what it is they'll learn, and how that ties into what they'll be able to do differently, I think is a really powerful one-two combination for a sales page.
Nicole:I agree, because right now I have, “Here’s What You'll Get”. And it doesn't really speak to the breadth and depth of the course. And really the months and months of work that I put into this.
Lee: Yes, yes. And I think that's when we start from the benefits approach. Like here's everything in the course. That is important information to have. But if we haven't properly prepared our reader or our student for it, then they're going to feel overwhelmed. It's this idea of taking them on a journey through your landing page or through your sales page. So you're opening with anchoring them into the now: what they're currently experiencing, what's working, what's not working, and then introducing the ideal outcome. So where they want to be, what that looks like, what that feels like. Once we've got both of those pieces of the puzzle really well defined, then we introduce the course as the connection point between where they are now and where they want to be. We go into what the course offers and then tying it all into that big picture vision and what they desire.
Nicole: That sounds great. Yeah, I really like the way you've flesh that out for me.
Lee: I'm glad, I'm glad. And I will say like one of the reasons I like this approach so much is because it feels very familiar to us, because we are used to stories. I mean, many of us read stories when we were children, we understand the arc of a journey. And so when we can bring that into our sales page, then it's familiar. And people feel comfortable, and they know what to expect. And then when they get it, they're satisfied. And it's like, “Alright, I want more”.
Nicole: And I do want to be mindful on my sales page, because I've seen other people that, you know, they are taking funnel classes and their sales pages are 16 million pages long, and it's so overwhelming. So I just want to be mindful of hitting the sweet spot between not overwhelming the person that's going to be landing at that page.
Lee: I am so glad you brought that up, Nicole, because I have seen that too. And it's amazing how you can-
Nicole: It’s so stressful.
Lee: It is, and you can land on a $27 product and it’s notes and then pages, and pages, and pages of text,  on and on and on.
Nicole: And then I've said to folks, “You know, it seems a little long”, and they're like, “Well, you know, I paid for this funnel”. And that's what they say. And it's like, yeah, but how does it feel for you? You know, does it feel authentic? Is it? How does it feel for you? You know what I mean?
Lee: I wish you could see me over here because I'm like raising my hands, hallelujah. Because, and I, this might be a bit of a hot take, but we're gonna go there. Sometimes I get the feeling that the goal is to exhaust the reader with all of this content so that they're fatigued. And then they're like, “I'll just buy it already”, you know? And so it doesn't become a process to support them in their purchase, it actually becomes a process of creating obstacles and overwhelm so that they feel like the only thing they can do is buy it.
Nicole: Oh my god, kind of like, make it stop, let me just buy it now.
Lee: Yeah, yeah. And it may be a stretch to call that unethical. I think that word ethical gets thrown out a lot when it's not always accurate, sometimes.
Nicole: It  just doesn't feel authentic for me. And it might feel authentic for others. But for me, it just doesn't strike the right balance, because I positioned myself as an intuitive career coach. So it doesn't strike the right balance for me, between business and the more intuition “woowoo” side, you know?
Lee: Absolutely. And so your task then is going to be how to find that sweet spot between educating and informing your future students, so they can make an educated decision without overwhelming them. And I find that the more detailed a program is, the more components there are to it, a more explanation we may need. But again, we don't need to go overboard with that.
Nicole: Right? I mean, I'm going to provide the course outline. I will, you know, give more information. But, you know, I recently read a funnel course funnel that was so long my eyes were crossed at the end, and I'm like, “I can't even, I don't even want to do this anymore”.
Lee: Yeah, yes. And then what happens? People don't buy, they go up to that little x in the corner, and they exit your page, and they're gone.
Nicole: Yeah, “I'm done with this”, you know? And it's in it, I want it to be enjoyable. I want it to be informative. I want people to get excited about it. And I don't want to stress them out, because they can have that somewhere else.
Lee: You're exactly right. So that leads me to another question. Where does your ideal student need to be so that they are ready for your course? Like, are there certain thoughts they need to hold or feelings they need to embody? Or even experiences they need to have in order to be fully prepared for what you're about to guide them through?
Nicole: Wow, really good, really good question. My ideal client would be someone who's ready to take a transformative journey. So this is a six month process. They're not looking for the quick fix for me to help them in three sessions and we're done. They're really looking to dig in. And they've had full experiences with their jobs, they've had burnout, they might be in burnout. They might feel hopeless, but they know, there's some part of them that has a light that knows that things can get better and they're willing to dig in, do the work, and really get the diamonds out of it.
Lee: Yes. So there is not just an awareness of what's going on and what they want, but there's a motivation there too, and their willingness, and they want this in depth intimate longer term journey with you right?
Nicole. Yes. Because I'm also what I'm positioning this as it's not just a work journey, it's a life transforming journey. So you get two things for your buck, you know what I mean? There's a lot of self reflection, there's journaling, there's worksheets, there's audio contents, you know? It's not a lot, it's not overwhelming, but you know, you have to do the work in order to make it work for you.
Lee: Agreed. Yeah, agreed. So the reason that I asked that question was because I'm curious, and I'd love to know if this is something you're interested in and if you want to explore it, But what we could talk about is creating some sort of event, whether free or paid, that people go through as a precursor to this course. And then you introduce them to the course as kind of the next logical step.
Nicole: Okay, yeah, I mean, I'd certainly be open to that. I'm pretty open to a lot of things. Cool.
Lee: Cool, that we can kind of, we can kind of explore what that might look like. And I'm positive, actually, you've seen examples of this. Anytime there's a free webinar that leads into a paid offer, that's what we're talking about. We're talking about an event where you are showing up and serving your audience, it's not just a sales pitch, you are providing something of value to them as a way of introducing them to this robust program and helping them feel ready to take that next step with you.
Nicole: Yeah, it's certainly something I would entertain. It does feel a little scary, if I might be perfectly honest. But I've seen you, you do this. And I've seen other folks do it. And you're offering free information. And then if they choose to take part in your course, great. If they don't, they don't, but you're giving up yourself.
Lee: Yes. And it can be free, free is certainly one path, it doesn't have to be. It could also be a lower cost workshop seat, like a $47 or $97 workshop. It could be a $27 resource guide, and you've got a live Q&A session, and then it directs them into the course. You have options here. If you want it to be free, we can talk about what that would look like, if you aren't comfortable with that, and would prefer to make it a paid product, that's certainly a workable option as well, and one that I've had some success with. So I don't think there's a right or wrong answer here. But it does come down to where your people need to be in order to feel ready to start this course with you, and how can you help get them to that point.
Nicole: And I think because of the course, I'm transparent about the course and the pricing. And the pricing may be, you know, it's not inexpensive. So perhaps they need a little bit more of a taste of the course so that they can feel more comfortable with joining and getting the coaching. And the course.
Lee: You may be right, it may be about warming them up. So that it's a matter of them building their familiarity with you, building their trust in you. And then understanding that you are an expert in this, you know what you're talking about, you are the perfect guide for them through this journey. So it's not about you. And it's more about is this the right time, and is this the right fit?
Nicole: Right. I mean, I like that idea. Because it's marketing, but it's not marketing, I would offer it for free. Because I like the idea of offering, giving, being of service and then letting them have a taste of the course. And then if they're signing up, that's great.
Lee: Yes, yeah. So I'm curious-
 Nicole: It is a win-win.
Lee: It is a win-win. And it's almost like you would be providing like the pre-session, almost like an orientation session, so that they're really ready to start your course and hit the ground running.
Nicole: Right? Yeah, that's a good idea. I mean, it's something I certainly had not thought about. So it's definitely food for thought for sure.
Lee: I think that it’s something to play with, something to consider, and we can certainly talk more about it as we move forward. Tell me what else is coming up for you with regard to questions about marketing. We talked about the website, we've talked a little bit about maybe having a, an event to kind of kick things off, what else is on your mind?
Nicole:Well, I wanted to feature it on Instagram. I am new to Instagram, less than a month. And I probably have 150 followers, so I'm pretty happy about that. And my engagement rates are high. So I'm really excited about that, because I've really worked hard to create quality content. And I do have someone that's helping me. So that's very helpful to have an expert, I mean, so glad that she's helping me. But I would like to offer this to make this more prominent on my Instagram. And that is my plan to do it soon. For example, what I would do is like my first module is permission to change. And I would offer you know, “why is it important to get permission to change before you even start a course”. And it's important because sometimes you need someone to tell you you can do it. Yeah, you can get out of that job and move on to something new. So, snippets.
Lee: What  I'm already seeing is ways that we can pull in Instagrams visual elements to this because first and foremost, Instagram is a visual platform. Whether it's through video, or reels, or posts. And so like, I can just imagine you creating an Instagram story graphic that is a permission slip, and having people fill in the position slip, and then they post it on their stories, they tag you, you got a hashtag. Like, you could really kind of create something to build the visibility and to get people really excited about it.
Nicole: Yeah, I think that sounds really, really good. And to be honest with you, I probably will actually give a snippet of each part of my course on Instagram. Just like a little, you know, soundbite.
Lee: Absolutely. This is one area where you could do a, I mean, reels are pretty quick. So that would have to be like, really a soundbite, you may decide that you want to do an Instagram Live, and maybe go a little longer, 5-10 minutes, and provide a core concept from that module. And in fact, I think the more ways we're able to repurpose some of that content, the better. So if we've got a quick reel, that's going to draw people in there, probably increase your followers. And then you can refer them to your longer form content, so that they can watch that and get to know it even more. If we've got shareable things, so they can share the posts, they can share stories. Again, it's just going to build a lot of buzz around this. And it could be a really fun way to highlight what you've got going on with this course.
Nicole: Yeah, I mean, I do appreciate your insights. Because you know, I'm new to Instagram, even though Keegan Jennings is helping me, and you know Keegan, she's wonderful.
Lee: She's fantastic.
Nicole: Yeah, she's fabulous. She's just so so supportive. But, I'm now taking the wheel. No, I'm taking the wheel and taking ownership of my Instagram. And, you know, I want to be very purposeful with it.
Lee: Yes. So this is where maybe going module by module, and being really clear about what elements of this module need to stay within the course, what is exclusive to students, and what is maybe one or two ideas/concepts that we can pull out of the course that I could create content around. So whether it is a quote post, whether it's a graphic, whether it's a reel, or a live. And so that way, you're being really intentional around what stays in the course, what doesn't, and then how you want to share some of the broader messages with your audience.
Nicole: Right. Because I want to give a peek, but I'm not giving it  away for free. I mean, there's that line. And so I want to, you know, be of service. But I also, you know, spent six months working on this course.
Lee: Yes, we want to get eyes on it so we can get some people enrolled.
Nicole: Exactly, exactly. So how, I'm just curious how you would, I'm putting together a map, I like to batch my content a month in advance. And that's, that's ambitious, I know. But I'm working on that now. And my thought would be to, maybe every week offer a little snippet of the course.
Lee: I really like that idea. And in fact, I really like that idea. And I think sharing on a weekly basis within a larger content strategy could be really powerful. And Nicole, as a Coach with Clarity member, you've got access to all of the archived guest expert trainings that we've ever had. And one of them is with Andrea Jones of Savvy Social School. And in that training, she talks about her model for social media posts, and we'll make sure we've got a link to Savvy Social School in the notes because I know she had it.
Nicole: I missed that one. I missed that one.
Lee:  Definitely go back and watch it because she talks about her, I believe it's five pillars of different types of content. And education is one of those pillars. So you could have that, you could do an educational post every week and then complement it with some other types of posts. Whether it's more engagement focused, whether it's a sales post, there are ways that you can do that. So you're providing some variety and you also have a structured approach that's practically plug and play. So once you figure out, “Okay, I'm going to do this type of post on this day”, then you're off and running.
Nicole: I'm wondering if I should go back to Keegan though and get help with this in terms of executing it. Even though I know I can do it on my own, I think I need maybe a little bit of help just to make sure it goes off.
Lee: Well, I am a huge proponent for getting help. And she knows her stuff. Absolutely. So I think she would be a wonderful resource for you.
Nicole: Right, I'll give her a call.
Lee: No, I yeah. I'm also so I love Instagram. I think it is a great platform for the audience that you're looking to build here. I'm curious if you have considered or if you're looking at any other social media platforms, in addition to Instagram.
Nicole: So I'm actually not right now. I mean, I'm cross posting on Facebook. But what I'm doing now in order to get eyes on my site and for people to know who I am is pitching stories to different magazines and stuff like that. That's another way.
Lee: Yes, guest blog posting and that sort of thing.
 Nicole: Yes. But also, you know, have you heard of Haro, help a reporter out?
Lee: Yes. In fact, within the membership, we have a training on how to use Haro, with Melody.
so yeah, for sure.
Nicole: It is a wonderful system.
Lee: For people who are not familiar with it, Haro stands for Help A Reporter Out. And it's a wonderful tool to connect experts with journalists who are writing stories on topics that you can provide quotes and information for. So it's a wonderful tool, Help a Reporter Out.
Nicole: Right. And Kimberly Perlin is the person, it's P E R L I N, and she's the one that actually gave me personal training on it. I haven't put it into play. But that is another marketing strategy that appeals to me because I've been an editor at Deloitte & Touche, I have a big background in writing. And I think I could do that very, pretty easily. And so I think that would be another option for marketing.
Lee:100%. Nicole, I think that is a fantastic strategy for you. I love that. So combining Haro, which is being seen on other people's platforms whether it's a friend or so forth, with Instagram to kind of create your own content, I think would be really powerful. I love focusing on one social media platform at a time. So if Instagram is where you want to put your energy, I fully support that. Yeah, especially for the first 60 to 90 days. After that point, you may have enough data to determine, “Okay, is Instagram worth it? You know, am I getting a return on the time that I'm spending here? Do I want to add on another platform? Do I want to replace it?”. The one that comes to mind, of course, because what you're dealing with is career related is LinkedIn. And I wasn't sure if you had given any thought to that yet.
Nicole: Yes, so LinkedIn is actually on my radar, I have found a few folks to help me with my LinkedIn page. Because I feel like that is very important. And Keegan Jennings wanted me to be very nimble on LinkedIn to really have a really good LinkedIn page and etc. But I've just put that on the back burner, because I'm doing Instagram and then the Haro but it's definitely on my radar.
Lee: And I think that is perfect. Nicole, I think that's a perfect strategy.
Nicole: I am gonna get help. ILike, I know folks love that DIY stuff. And if I can DIY stuff, I will. But these really important things like SEO websites, I mean, I just feel like I need to outsource that.
Lee: I think it's important for CEOs of our own businesses to be familiar enough with these concepts that we can hire really strong, wise people to support us. So it's good to have a working knowledge of SEO doesn't necessarily mean you need to do your own.
Nicole: Yeah, I have my own SEO person. A specialist. So yeah, I agree with LinkedIn, that's actually, I really want to get my profile optimized. And not that many people do that. So I've really reached out to people in my network, and I found a few folks that do. So I'm going to kind of interview them. And so because of careers, LinkedIn is important. Facebook, I'm cross posting on Facebook but to be honest, I just don't love posting there. The engagement just isn't there for me. I need that engagement, that back and forth.
Lee: Yes, I agree with you wholeheartedly. And I think we've seen some major shifts in Facebook engagement with their algorithms, also around use of personal identifying information and ads, and so forth. I think we're seeing a little bit of Facebook backlash to be quite honest with you, so it's probably wise to be looking at other platforms for your audience and for your topic.
Nicole: I mean, Facebook is great, you know. I'm in your membership, and I'm in your other group, and I'm in a lot of Facebook groups, and I really get a lot of value with networking with other coaches, therapists, etc, I've gotten a lot of value from that. But posting, I'm finding there that it's just not, it's just not worth all the time and the effort. Because you know, I'm trying to batch post a month in advance, and that's a lot of work. I mean, people think you're just throwing it up there and just see what sticks on the wall. But for me, I really have to get very organized with Canva. And revise my caption, you know. I mean, it's not stressful, but just really, I like to be very organized and prepared.
Lee: And when you've got that long term content calendar, then you can be really intentional around, “okay, I'm going to launch my course on this date, and how can I tie in all of my content to support that”, and you're giving yourself the luxury of time to plan that out, as opposed to kind of doing it spur the moment. Which, I mean, that's the strategy I've done spur of the moment launches before. I mean it can work, but there's a lot of stress involved with that as well.
Nicole: Yeah, and I, I am a planner, I mean, you probably know that about me. You've known me for a while, I like to plan and I'd like to be prepared. And that doesn't mean that I won't go in and do something quick and on the fly. But if I've spent so much time, money, and energy, having my own coach for this course, I really want it to be professional and done properly. So I'm going to get some assistance with it in terms of social media, for Instagram.
Lee:  I really respect that about you, Nicole, how intentional you are and that you do, you're very thoughtful. And you do have a very strong plan, and you know how to take action on it. And I think that that actually kind of connects with the last piece that you mentioned wanting to discuss, which was around making this a standalone or an evergreen course. Right?
Nicole: Yeah.
Lee:Tell me a little bit more about your plans for that.
Nicole:Well, the way it's set up now is that the clients would, ideally they would do the worksheet, and the journal prompts, listen to the audio that I presented. And then when we have the coaching call, we process. And so that's the way it's set up. But I would need to set it up in a way that it didn't require me to have any intervention with a client, they could just do it on their own. And it's not set up that way. So that's what I wanted.
Lee: I wanted to ask about the role of the coaching calls in your program and how they're used and how you view their purpose, side by side with the content.
Nicole: Right. So I feel like the coaching calls are twofold. It's educating, it's, you know, once the client has done a particular module, it's like, let's go over it with any concerns you have, you know, alleviating fears, just sort of being a touch, a touch point in the process. So they're not by themselves, and really encouraging, and guiding, and teaching, and motivating. That's how I view my coaching calls. And so if that's not going to be there, I need to find a way to make this course, I need to insert myself in this course. Yeah. Does that make sense?
Lee: It does make sense. And actually, Nicole, what's coming up for me is that, assuming you run a few live rounds of this, I suspect you're going to start noticing the main themes and questions that come out during these coaching calls. And when that happens, you may either be able to create supplemental content, or maybe you even provide a recording of previous coaching calls. So that they've got access to that without necessarily being in the live call.
Nicole: Right. And I have a coach right now, a business coach, and she sends me a training every week, and she does a 30 minute recording. And it's so helpful. And I can just do that.
Lee: Yeah, yeah. But you said, you may even decide instead of the twice monthly live coaching calls, maybe you just have monthly office hours, where people no matter where they're at in your course can come to your office hours and seek support. So if you're you're still available to them but it's a little less structured, and it's kind of a come one come all.
Nicole: Right. Yeah, I mean, I think that that's certainly something that I would really consider as I move forward in this course, and as clients are taking this course, and they're giving me feedback. And I'm refining how I can insert myself in there, and I'd like the idea of you know, my audio is just a few minutes. So really offering a teaching. You know, an actual teaching to go along with the modules.
Lee: I really like that, Nicole. And I think again, you know courses, even though we've got set content, and we record them, and we work on them all of that, they do evolve. They evolve as our students evolve,  and as we evolve too. And so this is something that I suspect you will continue to enhance as you go, you know. And it'll be roadmap 2.0 before we even know it.
Nicole: Yes, I mean, I was just working to get it up on Teachable and now it's ready to go. And now I'm just already thinking about the possibilities you know, that's what I do. I took your quiz and I'm a strategist. I'm a coach, I'm always thinking of, you know, how can I make this better? Or how, you know, what are the possibilities? Because they're really infinite. If you really think about it.
Lee: Yeah, yeah, they are. And I'm so excited, Nicole, this sounds like such an amazing program. I know, you're really working on it.
Nicole: It is exciting. And my coach, Molly McCarty, that worked with me to create it, I mean, I have to give her credit because she really was by my side the whole time. And I don't think I could have done this on my own. Because it's so intense.
Lee: Yes, it is. Oh, boy. Yes. Creating, of course.
Nicole:I thought it'd be easy.
Lee: It's a labor of love.
Nicole:No, it absolutely is. Is it easy? No. Worth it in the end, now that I've crossed the finish line? Yes, absolutely.
Lee: And so it's important that when we decide to create courses, that we really love what it is we're teaching and talking about, because we will be with that content for so long.
Nicole: We will be walking with that content and being with that content, so you really have to love the content, because it's just, it's a lot. And it took me over six months, just because I was very methodical, and I didn't have a timeframe yet when I was going to launch my business. So I thought, “Well, let me just work on this course right now. You know, I have time”. And that was a luxury. And so I am privileged, and I know that but on the other hand, I just wanted to take it slow.
Lee: And I think your course will be stronger for that, for having that level of intentionality.
Nicole: Right. Because I've seen some courses, and they're exorbitantly priced. And I mean, I can't believe some of the content is how they put some of the things out there that they do into the world. It's like,, it's just, it's just not very mindful or thoughtful. And, you know, that's just disappointing.
Lee: Well, and I think that really speaks to your integrity Nicole, of wanting to make sure that you are creating not just a quality course, but a quality experience for your students. So yes, the video and the instructions, all of that is wonderful, but you really are very concerned with the ideal end result for your students. And so you're making sure that everything you're putting into this course is to serve them, so that they can get that dream job that brings them joy.
Nicole: Absolutely. And my name is on there. And my reputation. So that also, you know, that's also important.
Lee: Yes. Well, Nicole, there's no one better suited than you to do this work. I'm so excited to see you bring it to life. And I suspect we have people out there who would love to learn more about you, and the work you do, and this course. Where can they find you?
Nicole: Well, they can find me on my website. It's www.rysemorecoaching.com, and I'm on Instagram @rysemorecoaching.
Lee: Excellent. We will have links to that in the show notes. So everyone go check out Nicole and her work. And Nicole, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for coming on the Coach with Clarity Podcast and sharing your experiences with us.
Nicole: Thank you for having me, and I appreciate your insights and I've really gained a lot by talking to you today.
Lee: Oh, I'm so glad I'm so glad it's been such a pleasure.
Nicole: Same here.
Lee: Nicole, thank you so much for coming on the Coach with Clarity Podcast. I have so enjoyed getting to be a part of your coaching practice. As Nicole alluded to, I've known her for several months because she is a member of the Coach with Clarity Membership. And I have seen her passion, determination, and motivation when it comes to not only this course, but to all of her coaching work. She is such a powerful and dynamic coach, and I know that she will be changing so many lives with this roadmap program. So definitely check out Nicole, you can find her on Instagram @rysemorecoaching, or or head over to her website by the same name and we will have links to all of that in the show notes for you. And if today's episode has inspired you to take action in your business and you'd like a little support, then I hope you will consider applying for a Coach with Clarity Podcast coaching call, you can head to CoachwithClarity.com/podcast, and just look for the link to apply for a coaching call. It's a brief form to fill out where you let me know a little bit about who you are, what kind of work you do in your business, and what you would like to explore during a podcast coaching call. We are currently accepting applications for the 2022 season of the Coach with Clarity Podcast, which I can hardly believe we're already talking about 2022, but here we are preparing for next year already. So if you would like to be on the show next year, head on over to CoachwithClarity.com/podcast to learn more and to apply for a coaching call. I will be right back in your podcast feed next week with a brand new episode. So as long as you have already followed or subscribed to the show, that episode is gonna show up automatically in your feed. And if you're not already following the show, be sure to do so so you don't miss next week's or any week's episodes of the Coach with Clarity Podcast. So until next time, my name is Lee Chaix McDonough, reminding you to get out there and show the world what it means to be a Coach with Clarity.

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